Interesting so both the Seeds and the Fruit were bitter, I’m wondering if you could just find the gene that turns on the bitter cucurbitacin and just turn it off with GMO tech? Would that be easier and faster or no?
Also excellent Pictures, Really Appreciate seeing them, I’m learning a Crap ton form them.
Very interesting, Pfaf did warn about the toxicity of the sprouting seed in it’s embryo (Which Probably refers to the Cotyledons). I think you might’ve just not ate enough cuz even a little gave you “Numbing Tangy Flavor”. Maybe for safety just don’t do Microgreens with Cucurbita?
Have you tried taking cuttings or freezing pollen? That way if a Specific Squash Plant Specimen tasted really good, you could continue to keep pollinating new plants with it? Surely/Theoretically if you take cuttings, you can grow Squash indefinitely right?
That way you could have back ups to go to? Or Possibly use Grafting to Encourage more Crosses?
IDK just some ideas to think about.
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WOW! That’s insane level of bitterness. Somehow like Vapo-rub!? Oh sheit! I Don’t think the bitterness in the stamens of my C. maxima Flowers came close to menthol level. (It did linger and was very bitter like ear wax with lasting effect).
It makes it feel like ornamental squashes would be less bitter? IDK
I like the Small size, I also hoping to eventually landrace “Pocket Squash”, that could be great for stuffing rice n beans with after being oven cooked.
At the moment I want to clarify that I have not tasted the seeds.
About the cotyledon, I think you and I would both agree in retrospect that it would have been better to wait for a true leaf to emerge and then taste a lot more of a cotyledon leaf, maybe just the whole thing.
I appreciate your interest and your questions. In the future I’d like to try to write up my hypothetical scenario for the genetics of this, a simplified flowchart based on the academic model with three genetic loci that I posted above.
My thoughts assume working on a small scale like I am – I imagine that if I had hundreds or thousands of crossed egg gourd seeds, it would be possible to germinate dozens at a time and be able to eat the whole thing without concern of needing it to still grow to maturity.
I have about 40 seeds, having harvested a range of 5-15 from 5 fruits. That puts me in the position of even wanting to keep this one vine alive indoors, just in case it is a viable cross
I appreciate your responses and Photos! I’m learning a Crap ton from your Knowledge and Experience.
Very True, I haven’t tried eating Cotyledons from Non Bitter Squash just as a Control. I’m curious as to how bitter the Cotyledons of Cucurbita truly are, and why Snails love to eat them so much. Snails eat Kale (that’s not Spicy/Hot Like Mustard), Spinach, Swiss Chard, all other not to ridiculously bitter leafy plants. Could the snails be telling us something valuable here?
Also since were discussing Egg Gourds, I’m curious, what is the smallest Cucurbita Fruit? Is there a Squash the size of small Cherry Tomatoes that can be Boiled and eaten with the skin and all? Maybe the fruit might carry like 1-3 seeds per berry, but still would be very interesting to grow? Is this where your Breeding Attempts may go? Since the Egg Gourds are already pretty small for a Squash?
Go for it, Cuz I want to see how long a Squash can last before Frost Kills it. Since Cucurbita spp. are true annuals that die back once enough fruit has been made, but what if the off chance you made a perennial cucurbita, that doesn’t die when fruit ripens? Or if you just keeping taking cutting indefinitely. Since you would always be taking cuttings from plants that haven’t formed fruit, if the annual theory is correct and fruiting is what causes Cucurbita die back (Not Frost) than it would be an interesting experiment for sure. It would mean you can grow the same Cucurbita spesimen for years and years, just like how it was done for the Grammy Smith Apple right?
Speaking of which, do you know what Triggers Fruiting in all Cucurbita? are they all Day Neutral or are some Short Day where short days trigger flowering?
I still have this one plant Alpha-1, uncreatively-named as the first survivor from the first of the five fruit which matured in 2023. There are some sweet potato leaves in the background, which really contrast with the mildewy leaves of A-1.
One male flower has already matured. I’ve harvested pollen and removed the flower to dry it to try to get every bit of pollen.
I will estimate that the vine is 1/3 the size of its mother and all potential fathers at the same point in their development. Those plants all had a mildew infection at this point as well. Probably the reduced size is due to my improvised indoor growing environment not being as good as the garden. If A-1 follows the pattern, it will be past the worst of the mildew within another two or three weeks.
With only one vine, infected with mildew, growing indoors where I’ve never grown squash, I feel my odds of getting fruit are relatively low. Yet I can’t help feeling some excitement and optimism that this will turn out to be a cross, and that it will produce some seeds.
I feel your excitement too! What you are Doing is AWESOME!!!
Very Smart! I would do the same. Are you going to Freeze the Pollen for long storage? Are you also collecting other cucurbita pollen in a Jar to mix it with?
